Gambling sites and ID fraud protection
This thread was originally over on the Expekt thread here, but it started going off on a tangent to talk about how safe your ID is when you send it off to gambling sites and what information you should and should not give. It's worthy of it's own thread really.
Being hit by fraud is potentially a MASSIVE problem we all face, but i feel it is such a big problem that we cant really prevent there is not a lot of point in trying too hard. By that I mean i just send ID in normal E-mails with no locks etc etc.
BUT I would never do this, EVER, under ANY circumstances:
Because if i am a victim of fraud/online theft from my account, and i have lost out through no fault of my own, i am covered by the banks insurance and i get the money back anyway. It is probably a bit of a faff but you do get reinbursed eventually. HOWEVER you are NOT covered if you are guilty of negligence, and sending a copy of your card with the cvc number exposed and all front numbers would see you fall foul of this. Its akin to telling someone your PIN number then them taking the cash. If they get the PIN covertly you are covered if you told them you are not.
Originally Posted by TakeAwayTuesday
All banks/cards may be different but that is certainly the stance at FirstDirect when I spoke about it, hence i am very happy to send any ID any site requests, but i always obscure cvc and four digits off the front.
Have a plan and stick to it
Perhaps we should have started a new thread on this topic?
The whole point of the move to chip and pin was not for our benefit, it was to move the liability for fraud from the banks onto us. If your card is used fraudulently these days it is easier for the bank to claim that you must have given out the details. Most security is nothing of the sort, its a theatre to make people feel better. This is especially true of airport security but not hugely different with cards. I actually pay Sentinel Card Services (or whatever they are called these days) in order to have my cards "insured". They also store details of your passport and other ID and will contact all your issuing banks if cards are stolen and wire funds in an emergency, etc.
Either way, I'd rather not have my details floating around the net in the clear.
Oh, and my job does involve security and IT. Even if I babble and make no sense.
Amelie's Dad - I always used to do the same as you (I also have a vested interest in IT security) - I used to send all my ID documents off in a password protected zip file and use some bit of information that the company I was sending the ID to would be able to ascertain (for example the answer to my security question). Unfortunately Expekt were extremely inept at dealing with this, as were Unibet and 888sport - with all of them I had no option but to give in and submit the documents without password protection (I'm talking about literally dozens of emails to try and explain how to open the ID and verify it before they'd process withdrawals).
Nowadays I'm afraid I'm less security minded - usually I'll try sending the password protected zipfile once, but if they say they can't open it I just send the documents 'in plain' and be done with it - as always it's a trade off between security and usability/time.
I will try and split this into a new thread, some of the posts might not make as much sense away from the original thread but it's worth a new topic I think yes.
Well I'm another IT/Network bod, and I'm actually pretty security minded when not chasing free money...
I'm sure the one thing we all try to do is separate our betting accounts from day-to-day lives? I have a separate bank which I use entirely for depositing at bookies or exchanges and don't do anything else with the account.
To limit the damage if your card was ever abused or stolen I suppose you could ask to remove the overdraft on your account (assuming you have one). I tend to have most of my cash in Betfair/Betdaq, but keep enough to cover new signups as I get around to them, so hopefully there isn’t too much in there to risk.
Also keep a spreadsheet with all your banking transactions in. You could use Microsoft Money for this, but the fact it doesn't support direct syncing with many UK banks (or at least it didn't) means it maybe easier to just keep it in Excel/Google Docs etc. I'm pretty strict about record keeping, and check my banks at least once each day.
I also keep records of what ID I've sent where and the details of who dealt with it from the bookie side. This gives me some vague feeling that I'm actually protecting myself, but in reality it’s probably worthless. I agree that trying to get some bookies to deal with password protected files can be more trouble than it's worth, but as munk says, try it once anyway.
Email addresses are also completely separate so that I can keep a track on who's sending what and not drown out my other mail with bookie stuff.
Slightly off-topic, but I use a different password for each bookie I have an account with also. Completely random passwords are hard to remember (try Password Safe) but give some piece of mind also.
Anyone got any other tips?
Nice coincidence to see this thread just as I'm considering emailing expekt for the fourth time about my id (I had given up about 2 months ago when I signed up and though I should get round to it now). It worries me a wee bit cause with some of these websites you really aren't sure who your dealing with and what laws apply to them.
I have a driving licence so tend to send that instead of my passport which I would be more careful with . Of all the sites I have registered with so far:
bet24 - asked for ID only
extrabet - asked for ID only
expekt - have asked for ID and card
Not too worried about the card as most of my matched betting is via my flex account which was specifically opened for it. However will be sure to obscure the digits now before emailing them yet again (if the muppets can get my details this time).
On an off topic note but related to card security saw an interesting story posted to reddit about an fbi agent who spent three years infiltrating a website where people traded stolen credit card details. More here.
Interesting looking story, will have a read, thanks.
Out of interest, why do you prefer using a driving license to a passport? Am I missing something in terms of how either could be abused in the wrong hands?
Don't really have a specific reason more a gut feeling. Think it's cause I associate a driving licence in my head with buying booze/getting into a club but see a passport as what you use to get out the country. They could probably be equally abused by various criminals to do whatever they were planning though.
Originally Posted by TakeAwayTuesday
Thanks for posting this - i'm absolutely paranoid about online fraud - have already had my credit card cancelled and reissued last month. I haven't had to send any id yet, but will know what to do now when asked, so as not to be taken for a long painful ride by some fraudster...
Only using one card for all my betting sites with low limit
Hope it never happens... (wishful thinking i know )
It really isnt worth worrying about although it does happen the chances are so slim you shouldnt let it concern you. Car crashes do happen but i dont worry about it everytime i get in my car. Just be a bit sensible, ie dont get into a car with a drunk driver = dont send your card scan with cvc number showing, and it really will be ok.
Originally Posted by psychobubble
Have a plan and stick to it
Maybe it's just best to try and bust out at the bookie even if it costs you a few £s. That's what I did with Expekt.
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