With my initial comment I simply wanted to add my thoughts about a specific question in the interview, that I quoted but while editing it I cancelled by mistake.
Originally Posted by Nintendo2k
Other than that I don't think this thread is the right place to discuss bet911 and bethorizon. I'm sure you know where to find your answers if you want though.
Anybody who is using googlemail check your spam folders - that's where mine was.....
Yes if any Premium member didn't get a copy just PM me and I'll get it to you but please make sure you check your spam folder first and check you are set up to receive emails from admins in your profile (you won't get the email if it's set to not receive email from admins).
Interesting read again, thanks
Nin, you might want to follow up here? Bookie wont pay up.....input please - Sportsbetting Forums | Offshore Sportsbooks & Online Sports Picks
Originally Posted by Nintendo2k
You may say its not the postup side of horizon involved, but credit side has exactly the same owners still.
I have refrained from comments while the bet911 saga went on but now that all seems to be over there I have to give out my 2 cents
As much as I like Carl, who is truly a fantastic guy, any of you think there is much, if anything at all, he can do, if "powers that be" decide to call it a day and run for the hills? I think we all know the answer.
I mean at the end of the day, the owners there are same type of people like 911 owners, they will have no scruples left, if things turn sour, to keep what they believe is their own and leave their clients stranded.
And I personally fear there is a deja-vu going on at bethorizon.
Same as bet911 it was a dead book with almost no action when Carl comes in, then he brings in his guys, but most of them are european AP guys and the customer base of active players remains small and most importantly very unbalanced because AP guys follow similar patterns so they wager more or less same/similar stuff and all that means it is a battle between the AP guys hitting soft lines and the house and the outcome could only be one...
Bet911 had less than half (considerably less in the last 2 months when football finished) active american clients, and bethorizon, is in the same situation, I`m sure about it...
Unless they show they can attract enough action from americans, and broaden their customer base, I would refrain from using them in the future.
What I have in my sig is valid as never before, wish I was disciplined enough to follow it all the time...
I am pretty sure that is their PPH/Agent side of the business. I am sure bethorizon does their part to keep stiffs away from using their resources, but they are obviously not perfect. I am 99.9% sure this is the case.
Originally Posted by MITK
This is not a horizon problem but a industry problem. Actually, you will find that other books, even 5Dimes, have agent/pph sides. Last year there were lots of people getting stiffed by "5Dimes", only it was agents using 5dimes services and not 5dimes themselves stiffing.
Carl has adressed this particular complaint.
That said... agents stiffing and giving service is a big industry problem, and if that agent that stiffed thebatchelor is still allowed to use BetHorizon resources, then that is not good at all. It is true that the credit and postup side of BetHorizon probably has the same owners, but the agent side is completely different, and it is not BetHorizon that is giving out the credit, but independent agents.
I`m sorry, Nin but you cannot compare how both cases were addressed by respective books.
5dimes terminated this PPH guy deal straight away and asked if anyone has any similar issue to report it to them in order to terminate all dodgy PPH agents accounts.
Here we have "thebatchelor" answered only when he posted at SBR 2 weeks after bringing the issue up at Rx and sending emails to Carl.
Carl gave him a polite sorry but never adressed his last post from 2 weeks ago:
You may also compare how Matchbook (who is same b rating) treats their credit clients, even though they were burnt very badly with over a million from bad credits in the past few months there with how this case is handled.
the problem I have is that my agent is continued to be allowed to use the services for his clients when I have yet to see a penny and at this point am being stiffed....that is a huge problem for me
So, agents stiffing money is a problem, but there you see two vastly different attitudes towards it.
And I`m not blaming Carl, he is forced to do what he is told to by the powers that be.
And I have read those stiff stories zillion times with offshore PPHs or with Asian books agents , where the book says, "oh we have nothing to do with your money, go chase your agent" but then they continue to do business with the agent as if nothing has happened.
I find it very convenient to run a credit shop, recruit american rubes thru PPHs, give them generous credit limits to wager, if they lose, fine, you harrass them to collect the credit, and if they happen to be sharps or just riding their luck, close them down and say, "look its your agent who stiffed you, we have nothing to do with it, sorry".
You are right and that is an extreme foul by horizon if they still take business from that agent.
I can only go on what I have read & it would seem there is no comparison between bet911 & bethorizon. Bethorizon seems to have good ratings & I also read somewhere that they have been in business for something like 15 years.
Originally Posted by MITK
Would TGT go ahead with this interview & the publicity that goes with it if the opinion of bethorizon was not high.