I have a question on the "each way" horse bets
So if for example i bet "each way" on an horse whore odds are 15 and it says "each way" pays 1/4 ... i will be payed (15-1) * (1/4) +1 = 4.5 is this correct?
What extra cares should i take? specially with NR horses
Originally Posted by hazard
Yup, if you had a £1 EW bet (so £2 total stake) @ 15 and the horse won, your returns would be £15 on the win part (£1 @ 15) plus £4.50 on the place part (£1 @ 4.5).
My understanding is this; if there's a 16-horse race with the book and Betfair listing 4 places and then a horse withdraws and the book has rules which say horse races with 12-15 horses only have 3 places, they will implement that yet Betfair will remain with 4 places. Therefore, if your horse finished 4th, you'd lose at the book and lose at Betfair. So I think, beyond the normal making sure the book is reformed etc, that is the major thing to be aware of. I think that betting at books with a "to place" (so not an E/W bet) generally should match Betfair and not reduce the places paid out of line with Betfair.
Edit: sorry, I should just clarify that this was just a 16-horse example; books may have a required number of runners for 5, 4, 3 and 2 places (and win only should there not eb enough to warrant 2 places) bu the general idea is that non-runners may take the places paid at the book down one step whereas Betfair may remain unaffected
What are the Non-Handicaps and the Handicaps on the each way betting?
Horse races fall into one of two categories: handicap races where the horses carry weight based on their previous performances (the better their perfromances the more weight they carry); and non-handicap races where horses race at their normal weight.
Here's some info about handicap races:
Originally Posted by musicbox
So when you go to drop the lay does it refuse it?
I've made a right mess of doing Tipico and have got myself utterly confused and wondering whether Ive got all the angles covered.
I found what I thought were some relatively good odds there yesterday on the Iceland v Norway soccer international (KO later today). But their site required that I bet on three separate bets. So I bet 50 Euros on each of:
1) 1X (double chance) @ 2.05
2) Iceland (H'cap 1:0) @ 2.05 (same odds as above)
3) Iceland 1X2 @ 5
Then to lay off or hedge or whatever the term is I did these bets at various sites:
A) Norway 1X2 £50 @ 1.91
B) Norway (H'cap 1:0) £24 @ 3.75
C) Draw 1X2 £25 @ 3.6
I also set a lay of Iceland on Betfair for a backer's stake of £49.36 @ 4.9.
Now, the odds have drifted and the Betfair lay has not been taken and I am looking at other ways of hedging (or whatever it's called). But in doing so I've become completely confused as to what I've attempted to do and unsure how I stand.
So could anyone with a geater grasp of these things advise me how to proceed? My head hurts!
I've always found the best way to resolve something like this is to knock up an excel spreadsheet with all the different bets on, potential profit and loss of each bet and total potential profit/loss.
So in this case you'd have this situation (see attachment 1)
The main thing I notice is the massive liability on Norway winning by exactly one goal, so I'd be looking to put something on the handicap draw (3.6 at 888sport or BlueSquare - make sure it is HANDICAP DRAW not DRAW). I'd also put a lay on Iceland at 5.3 to reduce my losses if I did bust out
Attachment 2 is a rough idea of what I would do - you can adjust the figures as you see fit.
I think Tom has beaten me to it and offered better advice than I would anyway. To stop anyone else doing the same though, it would be interesting to know why you had to make three seperate bets I cant see that in the T&Cs but it may be a different offer im looking at. There is a line that the whole amount must be used three times but that just means you must wager a grand total of 600 Euros (assuming 100 deposit and 100 bonus). You could do it in two bets if you roll up each bet and lump the balance on each time.
For example Stick 200 Euros on a 2s shot, lay say £150 at as close as you can get, you will stand a fair chance of just making £60ish into betfair. Or it comes in at Tipico, so your next bet is for 400 at 2s, lay £350 this time. This time its either profit to betfair or you can withdraw it all. You make smallest profit of £60ish if you bust in one bet, a bit more than £100 if you bust in two, and pushing £150 if it takes two bets and a withdrawal. Thats probably the kind of thing you want to be aiming at.
If you have 3x 50 Euros bets, what happened to the other 50?
I think you would do well to use those sort of ratios and bets I have rather than betting to the nearest pence in an attempt to make the same win or lose, there is some underlay there and you will be rewarded for the wins into Tipico should they happen. I am not sure it is even possible to back/aly to exact results on a multiple currency bet where you have a wagering, what exchange rate do you use? The one you deposited with? The one on the day you place the bet? The one you withdraw at which you cant even know?. I assumed there 100 Euros would be about £90, i think thats close. Trying to get it exact and doing things like laying £49.36, and betting on AsianHandicap markets, is really overly complicating something which is actually very simple.
I am assuming you layed £49.36 for a good reason, but if I was placing those bets (and im not sure I would) I would still have just made it £45. Im not sure you are going to be getting any payoff if it comes in and you must withdraw at Tipico. There is no right or wrong to any of this of course, but in the nicest possible way you really have made a complete pigs ear of that!
P.S. It is a good job Tom is here to help fix it.
P.P.S. I think if you step back and look at what I said though, you might be able to avoid it happening again. And if it helps someone else avoid similar that is good.
Have a plan and stick to it
Originally Posted by wobbler
1.8 1.82 1.9 <> 2.00 2.10 2.20
£50 £35 £75 <> £100 £150 £200
Ok, if you imagine you're seeing a market like that above (and the figures are purely for the example), you'll think "I can lay my £50 @ evens cos there's £100 available". So you go to lay but all that happens is something resembling this:
1.82 1.9 2.00 <> 2.10 2.20 2.30
£35 £75 £50 <> £150 £200 £100
Your lay isn't refused per say but you see that £100 was never matched (the market history may prove nothing was matched at 2) and your lay simply goes into a queue on the back side waiting to be matched.
I suppose it's something to be aware of rather than afraid of especially when using low liquidity markets.
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