Thanks guys, I figured it was legit, but knowing this forum was here I figured no harm in asking.
I was thinking of trying scalping and also in running to take advantage of over reactions.
I just tried in running with no software on the Pakistan V Eng game - It was going well, having made about 7-8 trades (all for only £4-5) had about a £1 of green on either side. However I then hit the wrong button and bet the wrong way. Instead of just accepting that loss I waited and waited and trading turned in to mug punting Suffice to say the odds on Pakistan have just got worse and worse so I'm still waiting!
Eager to give one of those platforms a go...
I don't necessarily think Bet Angel makes anything any easier mate, but it does seem to give you more tools which can help (or hinder) your progress.
Originally Posted by passthedutchy
One thing that Clackerooney mentions is market depth. This can be a huge help if you are trying to figure out which direction something is going and why.
Another useful tool is the ‘guardian’ option, which basically allows you to monitor multiple markets and flick between them (although Bet Traders tabs sort of accomplish this too). I also prefer the way bets can be automatically offset or stop losses set, which seems easier to use than the Bet Trader functions.
The graph tools can be useful, although quite how much interpretation you can put into something in the final few minutes before the race I’m unsure.
Another thing that I want to get my head around is the automation and Excel features.
I have to say though, if Bet Trader is working for you, then I wouldn’t worry too much about switching.
The videos aren't great quality, but from within the software you can view videos via the message of the day window, and this seems to show them in a larger, higher res format. Sorry, I don't know if this is something that is only in the pro (paid for) version, or also the freeware one.
Originally Posted by racer54
They do give you an idea on the functions though, but I'd say start by trying out the freeware version and see how you get on.
I don't want to sound like suggesting anyone go out and buy certain software, I think they get enough advertising via the various blogs out there.
Oh one thing that can throw you if moving from Trader to Angel, is that the the ladder setup is reversed on Trader (i.e. you see lay prices when trying to back and visa versa). This is not the case unless you set up reverse mode on Bet Angel.
I use BetTraderPro (BTP) pretty much every day and couldn't do without it. I've detailed the ways in which BTP rocks in a lot of other posts on this forum so won't go on about it here. Suffice it to say that it's an essential tool for match betting (well, not essential, but certainly makes life a lot lot easier than using the betfair website!).
Regards entering user/pass, as others have said and you know by now, it's fine to enter those in BTP. I did have the same apprehension when I first used it as well re entering username/password, but it really is fine.
It's worth buying a few minutes on the ladder as well I think just to see what it's like. The minutes don't expire either, so if you buy 200 minutes they're there until you use them up which is good. I usually just use the ladder if I end up having to trade on something, the rest of the time I just use the grid interface which is more than fine.
The Gambling Times - Threads Tagged with bet trader pro
I'm going to give it a go, and I have no doubt it looks useful, but I'm very sceptical of the profits that they list on those blogs.
If they were really making £20k a month, why would they try and sell that product for a few hundred quid? It makes no sense - Either you would work harder or find a couple people you trust to expand the operation. Betfair is a finite market, there will come a point quite quickly where any of the opportunities they describe all dissapear more quickly. So why sell it if it works as well as they describe?
Either a) they can't profit from trading or b) they give all these guides and tutorials so that everyone else follows a single trading strategy allowing them to predict prices more easily. For example, one of the methods they use is to follow the weight of money. E.g. if betfair has £8k on one side the price will go the other way. But if everyone tries to trade that point, the weight of money actually switches very quickly from side to side.
I'm go have a crack at £2 stakes as it is probably fun, but really it is just gambling with another name on it I reckon. I appreciate people may not want to share (for obvious reasons), but does anyone on here actually profit from trading?
I will post up my expolits if anyone is interested - Though I probably won't start this until the weekend.
Hi there , i wasnt going to reply as i normally don't talk about trading on a forum and i don't want to encourage people to trade as i think it is very much gambling if you don't know what your doing and even if you do not what your doing the chances of losing are still really high.
Ok trading , i started trading about 5 years ago , i make a steady income but nowhere near that 20k a month , i am looking through my diary entries and my profit has steadied , when i started i was less consistent , i remember i made i think 3000 one month and then the next month i could lose 2000.
Its been 11 months now since a negative month , last month i made 1800 trading.
I don't have any Betangel or Bettrader pro or any of the likes, i have been very tempted to get them but to be honest they look very complicated.
Last night i watched the video on one of them bettrader sites and i watched the example of a 0-0 trade on the Man Utd - liverpool game , the guy in the video put 200 on 0-0 and then waited till 20 minutes and greened up for 90 profit i think .
Ok now this is just my opinion but ,
A) you can do all that without any bettrader
B) that is just gambling in my opinion , the guy put 200 on 0-0 and sat waiting for 20 minutes and he got very lucky that no goal went in , how many other video examples did he make that went wrong?? the variance on putting 200 on a bet like that that has no out is too high ,your 200 down and no way back .
I trade football nearly exclusively and mostly premier league , i look at prices during the week and if there too high i wil back them but mostly ,i will be sitting down with my laptop at the start of a football match and i never take a 0-0 , because as i said earlier it has no out , ie goal scored bet down , it gives you no chance whatsover of getting out . I won't trade the first 35 minutes of any football match i have before but now i don't i very rarely trade correct scores and if i do i nearly always select 1-1 or 2-1 depending on a number of factors , ie what team is at home Favourite at home changes things dramatically , i nearly always trade the draw , i watch the price on the draw alot and there are games when a draw will start at 3.4 and after the first goal only move to 3.8/3.9 , judging by how the game is going you can get out with a smallish loss.
Losses- the biggest thing i learned is " take a loss " when i started i never wanted to take a loss ,i would wait and wait and hope for an equaliser or such and hope to green up , you can't green up all the time and i can generally get a feel for a game and if its not going how i taught i will take a loss and move on .
My advice is solely for football so apologies if this is not what your after , and the best advice i can give you is to have a look at the price of a draw and how the price changes when a goal goes in for the home team the away team and the favourite and underdog , try to guess what the price will be at different times in a game , i know for some games a draw will fly in from 60-70 mins if there is no goals scored so trade alot between them times.
Sorry my typing is not the best , i will reread this after dinner and try put in some punctuation marks if its not legible.
And one other thing is to expect to pay betfair implied commission.
Thank you for your post, it is very good of you to share your experiences.
I watched that same Man U game they posted and was very skeptical too. Really he was just lucky with the timming of his bets.
I think I will give the free version of bet trader a go, the one click betting does look useful. I can't remember if the hedge button is available in the free version, but that looks pretty handy too.
Thanks for sharing the suggestions on the ftie, much apprecited. I'm not going to ask any more about strategies, because I think the only way they will ever work is if you develop your own, but I do have one question about data.
Is there anyway to extract the betfair market history? E.g. Have a plot of ftie time against each price? I know they have that graph, but by the time the game kicks off, the detail of the event is lost.
P.s. one other question - What is implied commission? Do you not only pay commission on the net result?
Procrastinator, the free version of BetTrader is no different to the paid version. By that I mean that it is the same application, but when you buy 'ladder time' you then also have access to the ladder interface rather than just the grid interface.
Originally Posted by Procrastinator
I can't answer your data question, perhaps someone else can help there.
Re. the implied commission mentioned above I think LFC81Eoin must be referring to Betfair's premium charge.
Implied commission - i think this is what its called its basically a tax on people that are in profit , others will be able to explain it better , if you win over a certain amount over a certain period they hit you with another tax ,its fairly steep around 20% but i could be wrong i generally don't look at these things cause i have a betfair account for trading and i started with 1000 and only had one withdrawl of 1000 so the rest is profit.
I know you can see the graph when the game is in play but i dont know how you can see the exact time tbh.
I don't need to use hedge bets because i will generally only back say a draw and then i can see in green and red profit and loss and if i stick in lay on the draw and input a stake it will show in green or red ,sorry i explained this badly .
One other technique i use is wait say 35 mins if no goal is scored stick a bet on over 1.5 goals at say 2.1 for 200 , then wait 5 mins no goal lay off at 2.18 , you'll probably lose about 10euro but if you get lucky and a goal goes in the odds could drop to 1.2 and thats about 145 profit , so i judge these and take a loss if needs be .