OK, here's the legal position (unashamedly plagiarised from a legal briefing on developments in e-commerce law).
So we can see where the warning if your balance exceeds £1000 comes from. Whether making you sign up to a waiver amounts to "a higher level of safeguards" is, in my view, questionable. For instance, if you are receiving a significant sum into your Moneybookers account, you are only going to receive the warning after the event (or, at any rate, after the money has been transmitted to your account). I would also be inclined to argue that Moneybookers' activities amount to rather more than "issuing e-money" as they take customer deposits (and hold them for significant periods of time) but that doesn't seem to be the current legal interpretation. However I doubt that these issues have been thoroughly tested in a court of law. I will definitely ask the FSA how they see things if I can find the time.
In 2000 the European Union introduced a new directive to regulate the use of certain types of e-money - the E-Money Directive. In 2002, this Directive was implemented into UK law. The effect of the UK legislation is that issuing e-money may only be undertaken by institutions which are authorised by the Financial Services Authority (FSA), and those institutions must comply with both the regulations and the FSA business rules.
Institutions issuing e-money are known as "Electronic Money Institutions" (ELMIs). They must be located within the UK, and must have minimum capital of 1 million Euros or at least 2% of outstanding e-money liabilities, whichever is the higher. ELMIs may not have holdings in other businesses except those which also provide e-money related functions. They are also required to have sound and prudent systems and adequate internal control mechanisms and must comply with the FSA's money laundering requirements.
The regime places a limit on electronic purse size at £1000 per purse, to protect consumers against the consequences of failure of the e-money issuer, although a larger purse may be permitted where a higher level of safeguards are in place. E-money must also be redeemable at par value (minimum of €10).
The Financial Services Compensation Scheme (FSCS) does not apply to e-money issuers, and thus customers will have no right to compensation should an ELMI become insolvent. ELMIs do, however, fall within the scope of the Financial Ombudsman Service and will require their own procedures for dealing with customer complaints. As the ELMI is ultimately responsible for redeeming its own e-money, in the event that it becomes insolvent, its issued e-money is likely to be worthless.
If possible, you should try to get it to City of London Police as they do not have too much "regular" policing to do in their area, so they are essentially a big fraud squad and more likely to be au fait with this sort of crime than the local bobbies. Fortunately, Moneybookers' registered office is in Charterhouse Square, which happens to be on City of London Police's patch.
Originally Posted by munk
RE: Amounts in Money bookers ..
I generally don't keep too much but once I start moving into the realm of dollar accounts. I expect to keep quite a bit more in there. As in, all my inactive dollar float will be spread across NetTeller and MB.
For the UK one's .. I often throw a few spare 100's into Stan James .. lol .. they pay out to moneybookers in minutes. So I throw money in there .. either arb .. or don't .. you don't even need to turn it over once .. and you can access within minutes at any time ..
Naughty but it works for me
A wise man told me don't argue with fools, cos people from a distance can't tell who is who ~ Jay Z
Just had a read of this thread, really sorry to hear about the loss - it has definitely prompted me to do something about security on my accounts.
I know this has been mentioned already but absolutely get in contact with the FOS, Financial Ombudsman Service, and let Moneybookers know that you are unsatisfied with their response and will be taking this route.
I work for a large, UK bank - we are regulated by the FSA and regularly deal with FOS complaints. The cost to us of each complaint, justified or not, is, from memory, in excess of £500. Most times we will just compensate the customer to avoid the hassle, charges, and reputational damage of going through the FOS process. Another thing to bear in mind is that the FOS, whilst an independent body, are inclined to lean towards the customer's point of view if they view them as being 'reasonable'.
Let Moneybookers know what you plan, ask if the email they sent constitutes a 'final response' from them as the FOS will require this. Then put together a coherent letter/ email to the Financial Ombudsman (think it might be a form). At the very least you'll have the reassurance that an independent has looked over their investigation process and ensured they have been as fair as you would expect.
IMO 'sorry, bad luck' isn't good enough but I don't know enough about the law about these things - agree banks will usually compensate to avoid reputational damage.
If you have any specific questions about FOS, give me a shout on this thread and I will try and find out for you - we have people in my office that specifically deal with FOS complaints so they may know.
Logged in to Betfair this morning to find that a £900 withdrawal to Moneybookers was showing at 6.15 pm last night, which I didn't make. Went to Moneybookers and found I couldn't log in, as it didn't recognise my password.
Phoned Moneybookers straight away and found that my account had been emptied of £4.5K. To say I'm gutted is an understatement.
They say they will investigate where the money has gone, but I'm not holding my breath. I would've thoughtthey should be able to see where the money has gone, but from what I've read elsewhere they are pretty useless aren't they?
I have never given anybody my passwords, so I'm at a loss to understand how this happened.
NO WAY!! Ah that sucks, very worrying and I hope you manage to get it resolved somehow
Did you have different passwords for moneybookers and betfair as if so it sounds like someone had both, and maybe you should whizz round and change all your bookies ones just incase someone has somehow got hold of any others?
If moneybookers withdrawel has only been done today, can moneybookers not stop the payment, reverse it etc or is that already too late? IE if it has been withdrawn to someone's bank, it wouldn't be done immediately,
Fingers crossed for you!
That sucks mate Keep faith they could still get your money back.
Originally Posted by bioboybill
Did you have the same password for Moneybookers that you would use at bookies? Obviously it was the same as Betfair? I can only think it was some dodgy member of staff from a bookie.
Oh, mate, that is NOT good Did you have the passwords stored on your computer? Are your MB and BF passwords the same?
Originally Posted by bioboybill
Sh!t! Hope it all gets sorted mate!
Similar has happened before:
Maybe if you PM ChrisS he might help with what you need to do/where to go and what happened to him? I hope that helps and you get the £s back in the end.
Have a plan and stick to it
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